That would be a debate between using css or html attributes for presentation. For Row height is select Exactly from the dropdown. To me, its the most pleasing layout shape. So if you feel strong emotions regarding CSS layout, dont respond. The algorithms used for ranking most often are content and inbound links. It certainly lags behind other browsers, but for the most part IE fro version 7 on is css2 compliant. Im amazed people still argue in favor of table-based layout. WebWriting down the advantages and disadvantages makes the deciding process less subjective. I still dont know specifically which tutorials you mean, but I dont think Ive written a tutorial that offered the complete code for a website. Which is why Im not one to generally make that argument. I make a change to the template file and boom, it changes on all pages. Im still a little inexperienced to style the whole design in CSS, though. A paragraph? Even that doesnt work when they are not all exactly the same font size with no flow. : Get certifiedby completinga course today! Home / Blog / CSS / CSS vs Tables: The Debate That Wont Die. Of course that depends on the developer more than the code itself. it could also be your own code or more likely that your code and my code arent working well other. My point is that there are other ways to achieve this benefit. I agree with what you are saying, however I think with the advancement of HTML 5, tables will start to disappear. I disagree with you that both are techniques with little distinction. You can do that regardless of how you structure your layout. In other words you havent taken the time to learn how to layout a site with css. I think it makes them easier to move them around on a single page. Research Here are my questions. But clearly there are many people who support using tables. Read the post to find out why. Youre mainly proving my point that those who argue in favor of tables usually havent spent the time to learn to use block level elements like divs and css well. Out of curiosity did you read the post? The key is understanding that you dont really have to do as much as you think. Tables/grids (the shape) are the holy grail of layouts. They dont need a lot of fancy features or tons of content. Ive offered tutorials on the basic layout and Ive offered tutorials on things that can go inside that layout, but never all the code for an entire site. Thats easy. Table cells are the only elements in HTML that expand and contract based on adjacent content. I have used some CSS to style the text, but not the design. Hi Jennifer. For some reason this is frowned upon as well. search engines are more friendly. Sure. Theres nothing wrong with how you got here. Very amusing. CSS is better in both theory and practice. (801) 636-5158. Both my table and div layouts use css equally. The easiest way to create a table of contents is to use the built-in Tables are like having the blocks bolted together and needing all blocks to be bolted before the structure itself holds together. If there is anyone that actually codes full table-based websites by hand I would be curious to know what reasoning they have for not switching. An example of this lie is what proponents of divs like to show off by only having a few divs compared to a table structure, but in order to get even close to having the same properties as table we have to use something like the last example in http://www.vanseodesign.com/css/equal-height-columns/ as the others are just faking the appearance with a background image. I speak English fluently. Here are a couple of posts I wrote for another site to give you an idea my thought process on developing sites. acknowledge that you have read and understood our, Data Structure & Algorithm Classes (Live), Data Structures & Algorithms in JavaScript, Data Structure & Algorithm-Self Paced(C++/JAVA), Full Stack Development with React & Node JS(Live), Android App Development with Kotlin(Live), Python Backend Development with Django(Live), DevOps Engineering - Planning to Production, GATE CS Original Papers and Official Keys, ISRO CS Original Papers and Official Keys, ISRO CS Syllabus for Scientist/Engineer Exam, Interview Preparation For Software Developers. Laying out a site with divs has a learning curve. Im not suggesting its trivial to learn css, but its also not accurate to say the language itself is causing your specific layout issues. I cant go selling a 10 MS speed advantage to anyone and expect them to take me seriously. I can bring myself to use tables, but css severly restricts my deisgns because of cross-browser compatibility. If someone wants to use tables and it gets the job done then more power to them. I feel the same about maintain tables-based sites. As far as the speed issues, Google didnt really talk about load times affecting ranking until after I wrote this post. WebSome of the advantages and disadvantages of database forms are as follows: Advantages Data entry is less error-prone A number of predefined formats are available for use Usually, all the data fields for a single record appears in one screen Forms are customizable (compared to data sheet views) Forms can include instructions for data entry In my career I have worked with two types of people, fanatics and realists. And if you want to use a wysiwyg editor, they just dont work properly anymore in 2019. 1. With that in mind I prefer divs. Newspapers have figured out this ideal layout a long time ago, and have thus named their writers columnists. Covering popular subjects like HTML, CSS, JavaScript, Python, SQL, Java, and many, many more. In this case, it is almost impossible to get CSS only to render this as desired, either the width or the height of the side banner will be wrong, or the background image will appear to disappear or not be long enough, or be too long, or the content will bleed over into the side banner if you change the width of the browser. and on. In order for a browser to render a page built with tables it needs to read the code on the page twice. Theyre much easier to use now. How to override the CSS properties of a class using another CSS class ? As I learned more I stopped having those problems. I think making your structural elements independent is the better option. I typed along with all the code samples and it helped me a lot. They make a lot of sense for displaying things like data. The only time I ever use tables anymore is to quickly horizontally and -vertically- oppose an image or something else on a temporary coming soon type page. With Googles latest algorithm update (Caffeine) emphasising page load times as a SE ranking factor it is now more important than ever from an SEO stand point to reduce the amount of code on a webpage. Menu. Out of curiosity can you offer an advantage of table-based layout over divs and css? You have to look at the bigger picture instead of focusing in on one aspect of that picture. Luckily, modern sites have actually become pretty basic. Space on the server for all of my clients sites is generally 1/16 of capacity. Thats always going to be better done using css. I think theres more potential for errors with tables, but I know there are people who can code a search friendly site thats still table-driven. WebW3Schools offers free online tutorials, references and exercises in all the major languages of the web. I did say calling this css vs tables isnt really correct and that its really about tables and divs. Perhaps this is the reason this debate keeps going on, because this change doesnt look like progress to a lot of people and they feel the benefits dont really outweigh the intuitive design of tables that make design a lot easier for beginners. It sounds like youre good about keeping your code clean, but more code means more chances for error. Getting back to IE, the 3rd method you used with negative margins comes close but once again special considerations need to be taken with IE for this design, and yeah its not the fault of css but IE, however when the majority of your target audience maybe using this browser its important it works properly hence the use of tables which may result in more ugly looking code unfortunately but it is just one of the requirements until microsoft clean their act up. What happens if it goes 1 pixel beyond the the available size? I think your comments re flexibility and structure have merit assuming the only tools available are html and css. Also the css is alot harder to understand than it would be with a simple table layout. Tables can be part of your layout, but they shouldnt make up the entire layout. I watched many people struggle when it comes to nesting tables. Having developed and worked on sites both ways Im 100% certain structuring your layout with tables is not the way to go. E.g. The best things in life are not necessarily easy or easy to learn. Research another option instead of a table for displaying the This is simply not a point I am willing to debate. Most of the time when someone presents code showing the complicated css they needed the problem was their general approach. I also think that more code means more work for a search engine spider. Just because tables make one thing easier doesnt make them better than divs and css overall. Not something you need for a two column layout of course. The resulting code runs issue free cross browser. Thats it. Proving that the css layout loads 10ms faster (20ms when I just ran the test on your site) doesnt exactly endorse using tables instead? any pretty crap i use css on those parts alone. Take the time to learn how to use it. So what difference does it make? between the 2 techniques when in truth, there is little distinction to be made. How to identify unused CSS definitions from multiple CSS files in a project ? Now that they have indicated that load times will be a ranking factor I would agree that divs make more sense. However. They use less code. I fought this very same battle using tables back in the 90s. Advantages of Inline CSS: You can easily and quickly insert CSS rules to an HTML page. Then you can use divs inside your table. You do have to put in a little time to learn how to layout a site with css, but once learned its not hard to do. My question to you is Why frame this debate in terms With the 4 methods youve got the only that really comes close is the last & it requires more code. How to align a logo image to center of navigation bar using HTML and CSS ? Fixed positions make things more flexible? One must know these disadvantages so that he or she is aware and takes care of them while With the 4 methods if its important to a site to support older versions of IE then sure dont choose the method which might not work with those versions. There are multiple levels which creates confusion for non-developers and beginners. Unless you view the source code, it isnt always obvious how a coder puts together a page. Youre welcome to use them to layout sites if you want. Tables will get you on the air with display compatibility quickly and with confidence. If your dealing with a site that was built with tables then youre probably going to continue using tables on that site. I agree that youve made a case for flexibility, but I dont think your post demonstrates that divs/css are the best way to attain this flexibility. Teams. I agree with you about seo. A list? If you want to report an error, or if you want to make a suggestion, do not hesitate to send us an e-mail: W3Schools is optimized for learning and training. Saying things like, all people who use tables are quite frankly is absurd. Time is money. Tables should be used when a bunch of blocks need to depend on each other, like maintain the same height, or to cooperate in filling their parents width. Thats why this method is useful for testing or previewing the changes, and Is it possible that there are errors in my tutorials? To compare we really need to look at sites that are well developed on both sites. The argument is about how to structure a web page. and how painful it is just to align a freakin div on the middle of a page, align text with a image? By understanding what each layout method is designed for you'll be in a good position to understand which method is Maybe its not feasible in your case, but it might be worth looking into. Most of the time when I develop a site its at most a few lines of IE specific css thats needed. I had my old table based page done in 1/10th the time that Ive spent just trying to find some CSS code that accomplishes what my old header table didand when I started it I knew NOTHING about tables. When I first learned how to develop a website I learned to build them with tables like so many others. I cant tell any discernable speed difference between a table layout and a CSS layouts load time. Its easier because youre more familiar with using tables. Your probably right about round pegs and square holes, and I am sorry if you took offence, but the fact that countless people have these issues with css must indicate a lack of continuety with css. Very interesting information. The phone number and search can either be wrapped together in another div thats floated to the right or they could each be floated to the right independently. It still ends up being less code than you would use for a similar table based design. 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